Frustrated

Hi guys,

As the thread header suggests I am getting a bit frustrated with something and I am hoping someone here may be able to point me in the right direction.

I have lived in the LoS for a brief 4 years now and during that time have managed to get me Thai language skills to a heady level somewhere between atrocious and abysmal. I have been to two language "schools" (HA!!!) that were a little disappointing, shall we say, and attempted other "easy learning" courses as well all to no avail.

Then I remembered that to teach my kids English I taught them the alphabet and sounds first and so have already started learning Thai alphabet, pronunciation, tone rules and stuff like the which appears very promising. But where do I go from there?

So who here has managed to get some reasonable language skills here and Where and how did you get them?

Any links appreciated as well.

 

Hi

My Thai is fairly good, took a degree in it back in the UK 25 years ago. In my opinion, for what it's worth, reading and writing are the key to learning Thai well. How it is written is how it's pronounced. Once you understand the alphabet and learn to spell, everything else falls into place fairly easily. Grammar rules are simple, so is sentence structure once learnt. No tenses to worry about, just add a word to signify past, present or future.

I've known a fair few farang here who have had excellent results using the Benjawan Becker books. All have said the same thing, do an hour or two a day and within a year they were speak very decent Thai. You just need a Thai to go over the sounds of the alphabet with you, then you can pretty much go it alone. Just keep speaking at every opportunity. Thais love it if you try!

 

I subscribed to Learn Thai Podcast | Learn Thai Language Course. Online and on the go! a few years back when they had a nice promotion.
The format is some videos with downloadable PDF, etc... Licence for 5 years. It goes from phonetic numbers to advanced writing so whatever your level, you'll find material to improve.
There is probably better/cheaper resources out there, I didn't study the market
You can also watch some thai movies/series with english subtitles (plenty available for free on YT)... That's pretty much how I learned English.

 

@Nakhonsisean the work I am doing now on learning the Thai alphabet, a nice little online course I found, has taught me more in 3 days than I learned in the last 4 years about pronciation and tones so I definately agree it is the way to learn Thai, it also covers reading.

I live in Isaan, Sakon Nakhon, on my better half so familiy farm and so have a lot of Thai to listen to, unfortunately Isaan Thai with the strong Loas influence so the normal Thai I have managed to learn is only partially useful. Lol. But I have really picked up the sounds and tones by listening and talking where I can.

@pierdon agree with the Thai Tv etc. the more exposure the better.

I will look at the app and the books mentioned in both posts. I have found the Nemo learn Thai app to be good as well, so far anyway. Lol

Thanks guys

 

This was a really eye-opening TED-X video for me to watch when it comes to learning a language. Probably everything you already know, but presented in a way that just "clicked" for me.

 

@jorakae tbh I have little choice here with how much English I speak. There is only one person here I can do that with. And I have 7 adults and 2 kids wanting to talk to me all the time. Lol

 

Well i do not qualify for an answer since i havent aquired decent thai language skills since my 5 years of being here ...
but i know quite a bit about the brain and how it processes information and what blocks it ... so maybe just this is thats holding you back.

All i say is backed up by leading brain researchers so its not not that i just made that up

1st: Excitement / Enthusiasm .... The most crucial thing for learning anything is the Excitement. If you are excited to explore anything things will go very easy and be stored in you brain very quickly. Thats the same way Kinds learn ...btw ... if you look at their faces how excited they are to explore things, they try over and over again and sometimes we have to think from where do they have this sheer never ending energy. For us a bit olderly people ... Make sure your excitement to learn the language stays intact, what put me down the most is that i get corrected on every ******* thing i say, therefore i dont wanna try anymore at all. So you should check if your Enthusiasm is still there. Prof. Dr. Gerald Huether did run seveal studies on this, and this fact is truly exciting, that a 80 year old can quickly learn Mandarin if he just falls in love with a Chinese Woman

2nd: Learning with Computers doesnt Work, or let me put it this way ... Learning with Computer Aid guarantees that you forget things much quicker then if you would learn things the old stylish way.
Prof. Dr. Manfred Spitzer reasearch proofed that Computer Aided learning just doesnt work, Our Brain seems wired to forget much faster things which we can quickly access again. There are also studies that everything which is stored in a Cloud is getting forget much faster (I am EyeWitness on that, everything i store on Evernote is literally out of my Brain even when i wrote all the Notes down there myself LOL) - In the 60s we had speech labs, you dont see them anymore cause they dont work. Basically Spitzer is saying the worst what you could do to you Kids is giving them Smartphones or Access to Computers under the Age of 12. Some Proffesionals goe even further and say not to give Access under the Age of 15. There is plenty of proof already that Braindevelopments of Kids Stops or getting massively slowed down when they have Acess to Digital Moving Pictures (and yes that includes a TV)


..... So in Short, Learning works best in a Natural Way with other Native speaking People in a Fun Surrounding, while doing something you like or which intrestest You .. which is usually as well not in a Classroom. Most Crucial there would be to learn like Kids do ... so that the other party doesnt Correct you if you say something wrong, just keep on talking.

if you are an advanced student, correction is a good thing and it will make you better, but if you still cant do basic communication correction is the worst they could do cause it will steal you the motivation and without the Motivation to learn it, its all blocked.

I recall when i had to learn English in School, the 1st year all kids had excellent grades ... then Vocabulary Training and Grammar started and all kids hated it and had worst grades ever, but after Grammar Training and Vocabulary Test the Grades never went up again cause learning English was no fun no more. The only reason i speak reasonable english is prolly that my first true love was a girl from Richardson, TX ... while we stayed together my English Grades dramatically improved, thou i admit that i was still terrible in Grammar, not because i was talking wrongful its was just cause i couldnt explain why i said things the right way.

3rd .... If all Above Fails..... There is still some help to make learning much easier, and even to turn average schoolkids into superminds.
Prof. Dr. Haffelder from Brain Research Centrum in Stuttgart developed a NeuroActive CD and everything you do while you listed to that special made music for your brain (its a custom thing) turns into Overdrive, Learning goes in a very accelerated rate, The CD works like a Booster ... so if you hate doing your workout f.e. then you listed to the CD while you do your Workout and it will be much easier for you to do and i will fall into your brain easier and soon you will love to do it. So everything what you do while you listing to it, gets massively boosted. Therefore its crucial not to listed to the CD while you sleep or watching TV ... this is very contraproductive.
Most of German Top Sports Guys use the Neuroactive CD while they do their Training.
You can read more here ... Institut für Kommunikation und Gehirnforschung: neuro-active CD
As mentioned this is custom made for your Brain, so you have to go there one day to get your Brain Analyzed and it takes about 2-4 Weeks till you ll get your CD afterwards. There is a price tag attached to this one, but people using the Neuroactive CD are saying for what it does its Its way to Cheap. I did mine like 6-7 years ago and that time it was round about 500 USD. if you intend to really use it, there is no better tool you ll ever can get your hands on.
Also you should seriously consider getting it for your Kids. I have seen first hand how it turns Kids which where on a Special needs School turned into Academic High School within just a few Months. I gave all my Sisters Kids this CD as a Gift when they where at certain ages to make use of it.

Sources:
Digitale Demenz: Wie wir uns und unsere Kinder um den Verstand bringen: Amazon.de: Manfred Spitzer: Bücher
Mit Freude lernen - ein Leben lang: Weshalb wir ein neues Verständnis vom Lernen brauchen. Sieben Thesen zu einem erweiterten Lernbegriff und eine Auswahl von Beiträgen zur Untermauerung: Amazon.de: Gerald Hüther: Bücher

 

Very interesting information there @oil especially the retention of digital information. Better do some research there.

Learning Thai for me has been slowed for many of the same reasons as you. Not understood and ultimately embarassment on my part when I just can't get it right. But I am going to play the blame game here and say that most of this was caused by incompetence at the language schools, if you can call them that. At both schools I tried I found that outside no one understood me and when I asked a couple of friends why it was, naturally my pronunciation and tone. I asked me tutors if I was getting things wrong and was told yes of course I was. I asked why they weren't correcting these errors and was told in both cases that they don't correct their students too much because it "is not polite" no point in going if they aren't going to teach me correctly. It is the same with people outside as well. They will not correct you, even when asked because it is impolite.

Having said all this I am still excited about learning Thai. As mentioned before I live on a farm where I have only my GF to talk to in English and everyone in the area wanting to talk to me in Thai. I want to expand my enjoyment of living in Thailand badly.

Thanks again for the info Oil and I will look in to those links

 

I try to learn Thai for 23 years now with changing efforts from daily exercising to near nothing at all (most of the time 555). Learning the Thai alphabet / reading 4 years ago boosted my skills more than anything I tried before. As a learning aid I can highly recommend Anki flashcards. I can send you (or anybody else of course) my Thai flashcards if you want.
As I live in the south of Thailand, I have problems to understand people especially when they speak their local dialect (similar to your situation). I try to keep the conversation in my hands. Other than learning European languages, I can speak better Thai than understand it. If I just listen I end up nodding without getting more than half of it.

*edit* Damn, pressed the enter button by accident before I finished and proof read 5555 but I hope you can understand what I wanted to say. Still learning English as well......

 

I have the understanding problem as well. Mainly, in my case, due to hearing loss from years of shooting in the military. I just can't hear some tones and inflections in words at all. Lol

Another vote for learning the alphabet/reading/writing first. My limited experience definately backs this up.

Fortunately for me @Moog i can pretty much learn the dialect up here as I have found a course for it and I can always learn Laos as well to supplement my Isaan Thai. For me the hardest part up here though is that the locals all can speak Thai, it's taught in the schools but they only speak Isaan Thai. So they get all happy hearing a farang speak Thai and go off merrily back at me in Isaan Thai and I am lost in the first few words doing the same as you and nodding until I look like one of those toy dogs on the back shelf of a car. Lol

 

If you want to learn the alphabet and you have a smartphone download this app 'Keng Thai - Thai alphabet game'. It teaches you to read and write the alphabet, and it's fun. It is free, although there are advanced features for the full game but I have never needed them. They can be unlocked for about 360 baht.

Imo this is the quickest, easiest and most fun way for you to achieve your objective.

 

Sound like me. Taken classes, memorized lists of word and phrases only to forget 99% of them a few days later.

One tip a guy that speaks 4 languages gave me is when you learn a word or phrase, go out a use it 8 times. After that it will stay in your memory.

Whats the name of the course that teaches Issan? I'd be interested in taking a look at that.

 

I have NEVER had success with Thai looking at a page and trying to guess the pronunciation of a word learnt parrot fashion. I have done that in other languages in the past but I just can't sort it out in Thai for the tones and correct pronunciation so it can be understood by native Thai's. Even at the so called language schools you see all over the place I was unable to pick it up. According to my GF my pronunciation and tones have improved by a huge amount in the 5 days I have been tudying the econd coure linked below. (hmmm the letter next to the "A" key quit on me on my keyboard) Lol

Here is the link to the complete Isaan Thai course. You can buy the Beginners course and intermediate course separately as well.

ฉันทำเงินมากพอที่จะซื้อวิลล่าตอนอายุ 22 ในราคา 3,200,000 ภายใน 3 เดือนได้อย่างไร (คำแนะนำอย่างละเอียด)

Sorry about the length of the link. lol

A caveat on this. I haven't looked at this course in depth so I can't tell you about how good/bad it is as yet.

The idea is that you sign up for access for a set period of time. This goes from 1 month to lifetime.

I have so far been having good success by learning the Thai alphabet and pronunciation first, I am doing this through a different place as I found this after I bought it. There are courses for that here as well.

The course I am taking atm is this one.

learnthaifromawhiteguy.com

Easy to use and not boring for me so far. He is of the opinion that 45min a day will get you through this in 2 weeks but I seriously doubt that estimate personally and I am doing far more than 45 min.

Hope this helps.
I am hoping there is a good Isaan vocabulary guide in the course above, But I won't be getting it until I finish my existing course in a couple of weeks. If you do get a good look at it please let me know what you think.

 

Thanks!
I'll check it out.